---
title: Episode 026 – Radical Hospitality and Shadow Optimism with Chris Bartlett
description: Explore radical hospitality and shadow optimism in ministry with Chris Bartlett. Learn how to confront apathy, reframe failure, and embrace discomfort.
---

[The Church Podcast ](https://blog.marathonyouthministry.com/churchpodcast)

# [Episode 026 – Radical Hospitality and Shadow Optimism with Chris Bartlett](https://blog.marathonyouthministry.com/churchpodcast/episode-026-radical-hospitality-and-shadow-optimism-with-chris-bartlett)

 Written by [Christopher Wesley](https://blog.marathonyouthministry.com/churchpodcast/author/christopher-wesley) | May 20, 2025 11:42:13 AM

In this episode, Christopher Wesley welcomes Chris Bartlett, Executive Director of Ablaze Ministries, for a bold and practical conversation on what it means to truly welcome others in the Church—and what happens when we don’t. Through the lens of *radical hospitality* and *shadow optimism*, Chris calls Catholic leaders to confront apathy, reframe failure, and embrace discomfort for the sake of the Gospel.

Drawing from over two decades in parish and diocesan ministry, Chris shares vivid stories and challenging insights: from evangelizing in sports complexes to whispering catechesis during Mass, to redefining success in youth ministry. He urges listeners not to wait for permission to act, but to live out their baptismal call with courage.

This episode will resonate with anyone frustrated by stagnation in ministry, hungry for authentic renewal, or looking for a hopeful but honest roadmap forward.

**KEY TAKEAWAYS**

- Radical hospitality is disruptive—but necessary. It means prioritizing relationships over routines, even if that means whispering during Mass or making space for awkward questions.
- Apathy, not heresy, is the Church’s greater threat. Chris reminds us that movement—even imperfect—is better than stagnation. The Spirit shapes what’s in motion.
- Shadow optimism masks denial. It’s saying “God will provide” while failing to plan, adjust, or create space for real growth. True hope requires disruption, not just desire.
- Failure isn’t fatal—inaction is. Chris challenges ministry leaders to innovate boldly, track what matters (upstream and downstream), and allow room for mistakes that lead to learning.
- Ministry is an investment, not an expense. Language matters. Reframe your budget, your roles, and your goals to reflect the mission—not maintenance—of the Church.

**CONNECT WITH CHRIS BARTLETT****  
** Website:[ablaze.us  
](https://ablaze.us/) Email: chris@ablaze.us  
LinkedIn:[Chris Bartlett](https://www.linkedin.com/in/chris-bartlett-69b81024a/)

**CHRIS RECOMMENDS****  
** **Productivity Tool: **Praying the Rosary throughout the day—using key transition moments (driving, between meetings) to anchor the day in prayer and presence.

**What He’s Listening To:** Going back to full albums from ages 15–25. Two favorites: 

[*Live Across the Wire*](https://amzn.to/436KzwW) by Counting Crows 

[*Hello Rockview*](https://amzn.to/3YSaCFy) by Less Than Jake. 

These musical throwbacks offer space for reflection, nostalgia, and rediscovery.

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**Recorded on Riverside -**[HERE](https://www.riverside.fm/?utm_campaign=campaign_5&utm_medium=affiliate&utm_source=rewardful&via=christopher-wesley)

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